OPW — Oct 11 — How’s business? Its doom and gloom for the stock market, but how’s
your dating site(s) doing? Please post a comment with specifics of how
well your site is doing. If I get enough comments with interesting
specifics, I’ll send out a press release for Online Personals Watch and
the Internet Dating Executive Alliance giving the pulse of the
industry. Your comments please. – Mark Brooks
I spoke to a few people at iDate who, like me, were disappointed with September.
However, we’ve seen a particularly marked increase in paying members in October – our partners are already well above where they would normally be at this time of the month and it looks like October will be a bumper month to make up for a poor September.
The fear of recession and credit crunch may be keeping people at home, closer to their computer and therefore more likely to join the sites.
People will always need love, companionship and relationships – I’m still very optimistic about sustaining our growth.
Ross
I spoke to a few people at iDate who, like me, were disappointed with September.
However, we’ve seen a particularly marked increase in paying members in October – our partners are already well above where they would normally be at this time of the month and it looks like October will be a bumper month to make up for a poor September.
The fear of recession and credit crunch may be keeping people at home, closer to their computer and therefore more likely to join the sites.
People will always need love, companionship and relationships – I’m still very optimistic about sustaining our growth.
Ross
We discussed this at iDate London, on the final panel. The concensus was the industry was down. I thought there would be a knee jerk reaction as people immediately nix there memberships. Then I thought we’d see a bounceback as users realise that internet dating is actually a great value, compared to spending 40 GBP/$70 a night to go out and search out new people to meet.
One night on the prowl = one month on a couple of internet dating sites.
Mark Brooks
Online Personals Watch
We discussed this at iDate London, on the final panel. The concensus was the industry was down. I thought there would be a knee jerk reaction as people immediately nix there memberships. Then I thought we’d see a bounceback as users realise that internet dating is actually a great value, compared to spending 40 GBP/$70 a night to go out and search out new people to meet.
One night on the prowl = one month on a couple of internet dating sites.
Mark Brooks
Online Personals Watch
Sequoia Capital had an emergency meeting this week.
http://mb.snc2008.com/Sequioa-Capital-Has-Emergency-Meeting-Over-Economic-Outlook-1_308.html
While dating is somewhat down, Social Networking (SN) sites are getting crushed. I learned at idate2008 London that SN sites will be buyout targets. The buyers…..Online Dating Sites. They are ‘chomping at the bit’ waiting for market valuations to drop, so they can purchase what will be their former competitors.
We will be focusing on business survival at idate2009 Miami. The event will discuss market valuations, buying opportunities, market opportunities. Venture cap will be discussed.
The industry is on the rebound, as seen from my analysis on the idate Message Boards:
http://mb.idate2008.com/viewtopic.php?t=2933&sid=eced8509bc2acc05645ecf24340851fc#5084
Google Trends was pretty straight forward. We’re on a bounceback from the bottom. Worst case is we stay down for a little while more. I don’t really see that. The industry was hurt by free SN sites. The industry will be buying them now.
Sequoia Capital had an emergency meeting this week.
http://mb.snc2008.com/Sequioa-Capital-Has-Emergency-Meeting-Over-Economic-Outlook-1_308.html
While dating is somewhat down, Social Networking (SN) sites are getting crushed. I learned at idate2008 London that SN sites will be buyout targets. The buyers…..Online Dating Sites. They are ‘chomping at the bit’ waiting for market valuations to drop, so they can purchase what will be their former competitors.
We will be focusing on business survival at idate2009 Miami. The event will discuss market valuations, buying opportunities, market opportunities. Venture cap will be discussed.
The industry is on the rebound, as seen from my analysis on the idate Message Boards:
http://mb.idate2008.com/viewtopic.php?t=2933&sid=eced8509bc2acc05645ecf24340851fc#5084
Google Trends was pretty straight forward. We’re on a bounceback from the bottom. Worst case is we stay down for a little while more. I don’t really see that. The industry was hurt by free SN sites. The industry will be buying them now.
I agree with Ross. We aren’t seeing any drop in memberships. My belief is that as romance is a biological imperative, it is essentially recession-proof. It is like toothpaste and toilet paper. People don’t cut back on essentials during a slower economy.
Mind you, I am talking about online dating. As Mark was saying, it is a great deal. I’d be interested in the effect on offline matchmaking companies. People will continue to see the value in a $30/month membership (or $100/year) for an online service, but $3,000+ annually with a local matchmaker? I can’t see current membership levels staying as is in that business.
Of course, the proof will be in the pudding, as no one really knows the effect of this financial meltdown.
On a positive note as a Canadian-based company, our dollar has been hammered lately (Canada is a heavily based commodity driven economy, e.g. we are the largest supplier of oil to the US; with the dramatic drop in commodities, esp. oil, our currency has gone down a ton, that, and the global demand for US dollars right now, away from commodity-based currencies). It was trading at par with the US dollar as recently as July 2008. It closed at $1.1732 on Friday (it was $1.0827 a week ago!) and will likely drop further.
This effectively means a 17%+ hike for us (in CAD), as we earn USD, but most expenses are in CAD. In other words, we have a huge competitive advantage as a Cdn-based company.
Mind you, the CAD used to be worth $1.60 per $1.00USD back in 2003 and we have seen an erosion ever since. It is nice to be going the other way for a change. All that efficiency we were forced to implement to counter the FX effect will now pay off. We’ll be a more formidable player in our space than we ever would have been had our currenct not appreciated over the past 5 years:)
Sam
P.S. If we are doing better because of FX, imagine Marcus over at POF – he earns USD, too – but lives in Canada:)
I agree with Ross. We aren’t seeing any drop in memberships. My belief is that as romance is a biological imperative, it is essentially recession-proof. It is like toothpaste and toilet paper. People don’t cut back on essentials during a slower economy.
Mind you, I am talking about online dating. As Mark was saying, it is a great deal. I’d be interested in the effect on offline matchmaking companies. People will continue to see the value in a $30/month membership (or $100/year) for an online service, but $3,000+ annually with a local matchmaker? I can’t see current membership levels staying as is in that business.
Of course, the proof will be in the pudding, as no one really knows the effect of this financial meltdown.
On a positive note as a Canadian-based company, our dollar has been hammered lately (Canada is a heavily based commodity driven economy, e.g. we are the largest supplier of oil to the US; with the dramatic drop in commodities, esp. oil, our currency has gone down a ton, that, and the global demand for US dollars right now, away from commodity-based currencies). It was trading at par with the US dollar as recently as July 2008. It closed at $1.1732 on Friday (it was $1.0827 a week ago!) and will likely drop further.
This effectively means a 17%+ hike for us (in CAD), as we earn USD, but most expenses are in CAD. In other words, we have a huge competitive advantage as a Cdn-based company.
Mind you, the CAD used to be worth $1.60 per $1.00USD back in 2003 and we have seen an erosion ever since. It is nice to be going the other way for a change. All that efficiency we were forced to implement to counter the FX effect will now pay off. We’ll be a more formidable player in our space than we ever would have been had our currenct not appreciated over the past 5 years:)
Sam
P.S. If we are doing better because of FX, imagine Marcus over at POF – he earns USD, too – but lives in Canada:)
I saw a 10% decrease in signups in the US for Sept. UK, Australia, and Canada are pretty much flat. Looking at compete, singlesnet, match.com, eharmony, christiancafe etc etc all lost visits in sept. Because paid sites earn money months in advance for subscriptions they may not see a hit for a while.
I think people just don’t have the money for dating right now. People don’t care if a site is free or paid, its the cost of dating they are worried about.
As for social networks, no one is going to buy them. The top sites are Bebo, facebook, myspace. The rest of them are just spam networks with less traffic than plentyoffish.
I saw a 10% decrease in signups in the US for Sept. UK, Australia, and Canada are pretty much flat. Looking at compete, singlesnet, match.com, eharmony, christiancafe etc etc all lost visits in sept. Because paid sites earn money months in advance for subscriptions they may not see a hit for a while.
I think people just don’t have the money for dating right now. People don’t care if a site is free or paid, its the cost of dating they are worried about.
As for social networks, no one is going to buy them. The top sites are Bebo, facebook, myspace. The rest of them are just spam networks with less traffic than plentyoffish.
Are SERPs are about the same this week as in the last couple but, I have noticed less traffic. Adwords is also bringing in less visitors than usually.
After the initial stock shock, I don’t think online dating will suffer too much, unless your niche is single parents or something similar. These people will most likely be clamping down on spending habits. Singles with no dependants will still have a large amount of disposable income to pay for activities like dating.
Are SERPs are about the same this week as in the last couple but, I have noticed less traffic. Adwords is also bringing in less visitors than usually.
After the initial stock shock, I don’t think online dating will suffer too much, unless your niche is single parents or something similar. These people will most likely be clamping down on spending habits. Singles with no dependants will still have a large amount of disposable income to pay for activities like dating.
we definitely saw a dip this past week. the media’s ’round the clock doom and gloom news is probably taking a psychological toll on people and as tom said, folks are clamping down on spending habits, taking a “wait and see” approach.
depending on where/when the markets bottom is, i feel that sustaining growth w/ current marketing budgets will be a challenge. the good news is that while we do not control the markets, we can continue to work towards improving conversions, customer satisfaction, innovation and cutting the fat. i kind of feel like a start up all over again and this is good news…bring it on!
-saïd
we definitely saw a dip this past week. the media’s ’round the clock doom and gloom news is probably taking a psychological toll on people and as tom said, folks are clamping down on spending habits, taking a “wait and see” approach.
depending on where/when the markets bottom is, i feel that sustaining growth w/ current marketing budgets will be a challenge. the good news is that while we do not control the markets, we can continue to work towards improving conversions, customer satisfaction, innovation and cutting the fat. i kind of feel like a start up all over again and this is good news…bring it on!
-saïd
Traditional subscription based online dating models peaked and the looming economic conditions will only exacerbate issues. social networks have evolved into free ad supported dating platforms. meanwhile “live communities” such as stickam and woome have continued to penetrate the gen-y demo looking to meet people and, are growing at double digits m-o-m.
Traditional subscription based online dating models peaked and the looming economic conditions will only exacerbate issues. social networks have evolved into free ad supported dating platforms. meanwhile “live communities” such as stickam and woome have continued to penetrate the gen-y demo looking to meet people and, are growing at double digits m-o-m.
First level items on Maslow’s hierarchy of needs are all physiological (breathing, food, water, sex and sleep). I think our industry is safe in any economic environment. . . especially the casual dating niche haha!
We haven’t seen much of an impact on OBC. I agree with Mark – we’re providing connections far less expensive than traditional methods. For example, OBC is only $4.99 per month vs. $110 for one typical night at a club. How can anyone afford not to use online dating?
First level items on Maslow’s hierarchy of needs are all physiological (breathing, food, water, sex and sleep). I think our industry is safe in any economic environment. . . especially the casual dating niche haha!
We haven’t seen much of an impact on OBC. I agree with Mark – we’re providing connections far less expensive than traditional methods. For example, OBC is only $4.99 per month vs. $110 for one typical night at a club. How can anyone afford not to use online dating?
It’s interesting – as an offline matchmaking operation we have actually seen a growth in enquiries and members right throughout this period, which is typically our slowest time of the year. This has enabled us to open 3 new offices recently and one planned for the end of October. Like Ross, we feel that the desire to find a partner is actually greater in a downturn and is right up there at the top in terms of a person’s “hierarchy of needs”.
It’s interesting – as an offline matchmaking operation we have actually seen a growth in enquiries and members right throughout this period, which is typically our slowest time of the year. This has enabled us to open 3 new offices recently and one planned for the end of October. Like Ross, we feel that the desire to find a partner is actually greater in a downturn and is right up there at the top in terms of a person’s “hierarchy of needs”.
We’re dating/SN/community software providers and yes, we do feel a decrease. Lower investments and uncertain forecasts keep people away from starting new websites.
Personally, I like this kind of situations – they force us to think, act and react – they make us stronger.
So, we developed plans and strategies that should keep us alive and growing during the recession. There’s always a way.
We’re dating/SN/community software providers and yes, we do feel a decrease. Lower investments and uncertain forecasts keep people away from starting new websites.
Personally, I like this kind of situations – they force us to think, act and react – they make us stronger.
So, we developed plans and strategies that should keep us alive and growing during the recession. There’s always a way.
As for new signups, I believe the slowing in the economy has HELPED our site, but that’s because our site is 100% free. I’m sure the worse the economy gets, the more singles will turn to free alternatives, such as the social networking sites like Facebook, MySpace, and the free dating sites like ours, Dating DNA.
On the investment/valuation side, however, the downturn has certainly adversely impacted fundraising efforts.
Kevin Carmony
CEO, Dating DNA (www.datingdna.com)
As for new signups, I believe the slowing in the economy has HELPED our site, but that’s because our site is 100% free. I’m sure the worse the economy gets, the more singles will turn to free alternatives, such as the social networking sites like Facebook, MySpace, and the free dating sites like ours, Dating DNA.
On the investment/valuation side, however, the downturn has certainly adversely impacted fundraising efforts.
Kevin Carmony
CEO, Dating DNA (www.datingdna.com)
You would think that business would decline during a recession, but at Manhunt.net the opposite is true. Traffic, membership, subscriptions, and advertising sales are at record levels and have exceeded our expectations, particularly since July. We have a number of guesses as to why. New marketing leadership has focused our marketing efforts at members more likely to buy. New services have attracted new interest to our site. Mistakes and misfortune have afflicted some of our competition in the gay market. Our site provides an inexpensive diversion from the troubles of the current economy.
You would think that business would decline during a recession, but at Manhunt.net the opposite is true. Traffic, membership, subscriptions, and advertising sales are at record levels and have exceeded our expectations, particularly since July. We have a number of guesses as to why. New marketing leadership has focused our marketing efforts at members more likely to buy. New services have attracted new interest to our site. Mistakes and misfortune have afflicted some of our competition in the gay market. Our site provides an inexpensive diversion from the troubles of the current economy.
Our findings are similar to Jonathan’s: ManCentral.com grew by close to 30% last month alone, our biggest growth in percentage terms since the first couple of months.
Smooch.com also grew in all significant metrics, but most importantly advert revenue was up ahead of new sign-ups, generating our best month by far so far. Companies that have any cash at all still need to buy advertising, so maybe they’re eschewing traditional media in favour of cheaper online ads.
MakeFriendsOnline.com, our subs based UK site continues to do well for us, but like a lot of UK 2nd tier players has not seen growth in months, hit more by SNs, Facebook, Free sites, White Labels, etc. than the recession.
It’s been mentioned a few times above that romance is a biological imperative, and for that reason our businesses should be highly resilient even in bad times, but it seems pretty clear to me that when people are short of cash a free site is going to seem a a very attractive alternative to spending $20-$50 dollars per month. So while free sites are likely to get hit by a fall in advertising (this isn’t happening yet in the UK), they’re likely to benefit from greater price consciousness among daters.
Martin
Our findings are similar to Jonathan’s: ManCentral.com grew by close to 30% last month alone, our biggest growth in percentage terms since the first couple of months.
Smooch.com also grew in all significant metrics, but most importantly advert revenue was up ahead of new sign-ups, generating our best month by far so far. Companies that have any cash at all still need to buy advertising, so maybe they’re eschewing traditional media in favour of cheaper online ads.
MakeFriendsOnline.com, our subs based UK site continues to do well for us, but like a lot of UK 2nd tier players has not seen growth in months, hit more by SNs, Facebook, Free sites, White Labels, etc. than the recession.
It’s been mentioned a few times above that romance is a biological imperative, and for that reason our businesses should be highly resilient even in bad times, but it seems pretty clear to me that when people are short of cash a free site is going to seem a a very attractive alternative to spending $20-$50 dollars per month. So while free sites are likely to get hit by a fall in advertising (this isn’t happening yet in the UK), they’re likely to benefit from greater price consciousness among daters.
Martin
Our off-line division (The Right One, Together Dating) is on pace to improve its top line compared to last year. We’re seeing a shake out within the off-line space due to rising standards of service (If you can’t deliver on what you promise you’re out of business). With competitors going out of business we’re taking advantage…last month we opened Vegas and Detroit.
Our online division (LoveAccess.com, TogetherChristian.com) is doing pretty much the same as last year. But our white label product has grown…added 40 new partner sites this summer.
I believe traditional matchmaking is recession proof even at the price point of 3k – 5k. You just need to be damn good at it and continue to reinvent your marketing efforts. As long as we can continue to generate a quality lead we’ll be fiscally fit no matter what Wall Street throws at us.
Terry
International Dating Ventures
Our off-line division (The Right One, Together Dating) is on pace to improve its top line compared to last year. We’re seeing a shake out within the off-line space due to rising standards of service (If you can’t deliver on what you promise you’re out of business). With competitors going out of business we’re taking advantage…last month we opened Vegas and Detroit.
Our online division (LoveAccess.com, TogetherChristian.com) is doing pretty much the same as last year. But our white label product has grown…added 40 new partner sites this summer.
I believe traditional matchmaking is recession proof even at the price point of 3k – 5k. You just need to be damn good at it and continue to reinvent your marketing efforts. As long as we can continue to generate a quality lead we’ll be fiscally fit no matter what Wall Street throws at us.
Terry
International Dating Ventures
SelectAlternatives operates locally branded dating sites for client newspapers. We actually had a very good September ’08 as compared to September ’07.
Looking at “same stores,” membership revenues increased 4% while pageviews were up 20%.
Overall, membership revenues increased 10% while total pageviews were up 24%.
SelectAlternatives operates locally branded dating sites for client newspapers. We actually had a very good September ’08 as compared to September ’07.
Looking at “same stores,” membership revenues increased 4% while pageviews were up 20%.
Overall, membership revenues increased 10% while total pageviews were up 24%.
We are not seen any slowdown in this part of the world and the business is growing as usual. The impact of the US slowdown by and larger not affected the consumer behaviors in India and we expect to grow well as compared to the previous year.
Muruga
CEO/Founder of Bharat Matrimony
We are not seen any slowdown in this part of the world and the business is growing as usual. The impact of the US slowdown by and larger not affected the consumer behaviors in India and we expect to grow well as compared to the previous year.
Muruga
CEO/Founder of Bharat Matrimony
We’ve seen a substantial increase in subscriptions since October, with continuing improvement. We’re hoping that our new site design is primarily responsible for this, but the tendency to stay in and seek more meaningful pastimes (such as love) during a recession likely has something to do with it.
Or for the cynical, there’s this theory:
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/148959c4-c31f-11dd-a5ae-000077b07658.html
We’ve seen a substantial increase in subscriptions since October, with continuing improvement. We’re hoping that our new site design is primarily responsible for this, but the tendency to stay in and seek more meaningful pastimes (such as love) during a recession likely has something to do with it.
Or for the cynical, there’s this theory:
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/148959c4-c31f-11dd-a5ae-000077b07658.html